Tech Leader Chats: How to weave Justice, Equity, Diversity, & Inclusion (JEDI) into your leadership with Joy Dixon

Title of talk and speaker photo

We all know that Justice, Equity, Diversity, & Inclusion matter – but how can you put them into practice? What does it mean to make them part of how you operate as a leader? Even more importantly: How can you make sure you're hearing the hard truths? And how can you make sure you're learning without putting more work on the people in your team who are from marginalized groups?

To learn how to do this, we heard from Joy Dixon (Black Venture Institute Fellow, BLCK VC and Founder & CEO, Mosaic Presence). Joy moved into engineering management in part because of frustration that the JEDI issues she'd faced in her career were still impacting the next generation of developers that she was mentoring. She spoke to how she put JEDI practices into place over her career and how startups can take action, even with the limited time and resources that early-stage companies have.

About Joy

Joy Dixon has worked in the tech industry for 20+ years as an engineering leader, software engineer, technical trainer, and even as a network administrator. In 2008, Joy decided to move into technical training in order to assist people with successfully utilizing technology, and now is on her venture capital journey working with start up founders: advising, investing, and developing their MVPs.

Joy loves learning new technologies and has a great deal of passion for JEDI, teaching, coaching, and investing.

How to weave Justice, Equity, Diversity, & Inclusion (JEDI) into your leadership

See below for:

  • Key takeaways from Joy's talk
  • The recording from Joy's session
  • Resources noted in the talk
  • A transcript of the discussion

Key takeaways




[00:00:00] Lauren Peate: So, welcome in case this is your first Tech Leader Chat. We're really excited to have you here. This is a bit of an experiment we decided to run where we're doing a lot of work with different engineering leaders and so I wanted to just host interesting conversations about things that we know people care about.

[00:00:21] Lauren Peate: And in particular we wanted to do it in a space where tech and product leaders can learn and grow together. And in particular to do it in a way that cares about and, and really prioritizes justice, equity, diversity, and inclusion. And so to that end, we do have a code of conduct that you've all agreed to.

[00:00:37] Lauren Peate: So thanks very much. We'll be maintaining that as we go. And what's really cool about this event is this is actually our first one on the topic of justice, equity, diversity, and inclusion. So it's always been a filtered question that we ask and when we think about who we're bringing into the community and you know, so we always knew that it was really important, but this is gonna be our first time really diving explicitly into that.

[00:00:59] Lauren Peate: And so I'm gonna, in a second I'll introduce our speaker, but before I do that, I'll just introduce some of the other people on the call who will be helping out. So my name's Lauren. I'm the CEO and Founder of Multitudes. The short version there is that we do engineering metrics without the creepiness, so teams can deliver well without burning people out.

[00:01:16] Lauren Peate: And then we have a couple team members who will be helping out. So Jenny and Vivek are data scientists on the founding team, and then Brooke runs Business Operations. So you'll see us more in the second half. We'll kind of do some support around the breakout rooms. And so let's go ahead and dive into it then.

[00:01:33] Lauren Peate: Diving into oh, and actually I should have mentioned though, before I do as we go, if you have any questions, put them in the chat. We will keep an eye on that and we'll be asking questions at the very end. All right, so we are so excited to have Joy here with us today. I met Joy at another event that she was speaking at where she was talking about a related topic around the missing 33% of women in leadership.

[00:01:56] Lauren Peate: And I was really struck by her ability to just, one, bring a really heartfelt and genuine presence to this work, but also how much she makes this work feel accessible. And these are really heavy topics. They're really big topics. And at the same time in chatting with Joy, it does, it still feels like things that we can do and we can take action on.

[00:02:17] Lauren Peate: So we feel so fortunate to have her here with us today. And just to share a little bit more about her, she's a Black Venture Institute fellow with BLCK VC. She's also the Founder and CEO of Mosaic Presence, which does software development, leadership training, and is becoming a venture studio. So watch this space.

[00:02:31] Lauren Peate: Lots of exciting things there. And she, in her own role as an engineering leader, has put these JEDI practices into place. And so with that, I'm gonna pass it over to Joy cause we're all very excited to learn more from her.

[00:02:44] Joy Dixon: Thank you. Awesome. Thank you so much, Lauren. Hi everyone. Hope you're having a good day today. I am super excited to be here and talk about JEDI in leadership with you all.

[00:02:56] Joy Dixon: So thank you Multitudes, Lauren, for allowing me to share my thoughts around this topic. So look forward to sharing what I have as well as hearing your questions, because yeah, I'm gonna stick around so we can dig in to any of the meaty parts. All right. So I'm gonna share my screen. I have some slides for us here, so let me do that really quickly.

[00:03:25] Joy Dixon: All right, there we go. So let's talk about JEDI leader. Let's start at the start, which is very important here, right? Which is inequities must be faced. So here's a quote from the great James Baldwin. Not everything that is faced can be changed, but nothing can be changed until it is faced, as of the keep that in mind.

[00:03:54] Joy Dixon: So let's jump in and talk about things that need to be faced here.

[00:04:01] Joy Dixon: Does your team look like this? Right? And I pose this question because I really want you to think about like your team and how it's flowing. And what I mean by this, I love the apples, so nothing against apples here. But really thinking about like the demographics of your team, be it based on gender, be it based on race you know, age, anything.

[00:04:22] Joy Dixon: Really just stop for a moment and think about what your team looks like and then think about how that feels. Does that feel normal to you, the way your team looks right now that you have that flip it and think about, say for example, you were thinking, Oh, my team's like mainly male or all male, Flip it and then think about if your team was all female, how does that feel to you?

[00:04:51] Joy Dixon: Does that feel normal? Right. And the reason I do this exercise is not for right or wrong. But really about self-awareness, right? Because the way we lead is based on who we are. So this is really gonna bring us into that, like how our beliefs as well as our conditioning to really keep that in mind, right?

[00:05:18] Joy Dixon: So we got this. Why are teams overrepresented? And I intentionally use the term overrepresented. In the past, I have used the term underrepresented, but what I noticed about the power of language, when you speak about overrepresented, the focus is on the people as if they're the problem. They're the issue, right?

[00:05:40] Joy Dixon: We gotta change because of this group. We have to do this, We have to go take this class because of this group when the real issue is the overrepresent. So I'm here in the US and there's an article that been floating around for years around like, you know, how many Daves do you work with? I will tell you, at one point in time I worked with like four Daves and four months, right?

[00:06:02] Joy Dixon: So we really need to talk about what the real issue is, which is overrepresentation. And some of the things that leads us to this overrepresentation is when you hear statements like the ones that are on your screen, right? I'm sure many of you have heard these or some similar ones. You know, this keeps it, this keeps that over representation in place.

[00:06:25] Joy Dixon: So if you notice in the upper right hand corner, like the image that I have is of roots, right? So I look at those statements as root rot, right? It really just like you have root rod in any plant or any, you have it in an organization when you have these type of beliefs that are allowed to fester and.

[00:06:48] Joy Dixon: So let's all level set here at like what JEDI is and how do we move forward. So JEDI leadership practices, so break this down. JEDI, as Lauren mentioned, justice, equity, diversity, and inclusion. I know I say it all the time and everybody instantly goes to Star Wars. It's okay. But really what I'm talking about is justice, equity, diversity, and inclusion.

[00:07:09] Joy Dixon: That's the main thing, right? And then leader. There are parts of this that are really centered around the leadership, which is around courage and just leadership fundamentals, and then practices, which comes from like practice, just the verb practice, which is to perform a work repeatedly to become proficient.

[00:07:28] Joy Dixon: We have to keep doing this over and over and over again.

[00:07:35] Joy Dixon: So let's dive in and talk about courageous leadership, because some of the time, sometimes I've heard people like, Oh, I have to go learn about this. They think JEDI's over here and leadership is over here. Like they're in two different camps. They're really more alike than anything. If you're being a good leader, then you're probably covering most of these topics already.

[00:08:00] Joy Dixon: So dare to lead by Brene Brown. I am a huge fan of this book. If I highly recommend it. If you read it, reread it. It is awesome. I would give it to new managers. I saw there's somebody on the, just became a new manager. Congratulations. Right? And people who are seasoned in somewhere in between. And recently I took the training course for this, this work.

[00:08:26] Joy Dixon: Really good. It added another layer to this, so I highly recommend this. But as it says here, you know, leadership is not about titles in Corner Office. It's really about you stepping up and having the courage.

[00:08:43] Joy Dixon: So as I said, they're more like JEDI. Leadership and leadership are more alike than different. Can we just talk about basic leadership characteristics, your character? You lead based on who you are, right? So really knowing yourself is of the utmost importance. Courage. You have to have courage. You have to say the thing and do the thing in order to make these changes constant learners.

[00:09:08] Joy Dixon: We learn, we openly learn about various tech stacks and so forth. Learn about people, learn about their holidays, their culture, what's important to them. Across the board. Same thing with being a good listener. Listen to everyone. You're service driven. You're here for everyone. You hold yourself and other people accountable, empathetic, and compassionately.

[00:09:33] Joy Dixon: These are just good leader qualities, that's all that is. And then you think about your expectations for being a leader. It's about building relationships, not selectively, but building relationships across the. Right leading change. How do you lead change? That's it. Inspiring other people, right? There will always be those people who are not gonna go where you wanna go.

[00:10:01] Joy Dixon: They there will, but I'll just let you know now like we on this call, we are a group that who wants to move things and change things. There'll be plenty of people who don't, but you're gonna inspire some folks who do and who may be on the fence or may be nervous, may have some kind of. So keep moving forward and then think critically.

[00:10:21] Joy Dixon: This is huge. Right? Share a little something. So you saw before one of like the root RO statements was, we don't wanna lower the bar. Or the other statement is, it's hard to find these candidates Now. I've had people say that to me on numerous occasions and I've asked them, Have you Googled? Right? Most of them it goes silent.

[00:10:46] Joy Dixon: They haven't even tried to find candidates. They are just putting forth that same narrative, that same root rot, right? So really think critically when people tell you something. Is that true? Really question it. Then of course, again, accountability. I cannot express the importance of that. You know, we need to hold ourselves and other people accountable for their behavior.

[00:11:12] Joy Dixon: So we've talked about the found. Which is just good leadership. And if you're not willing to, you know, model those attributes or do those actions really, you know, I invite you to like think about if leadership is the place for you. That's just baseline leadership, right? So if we go here to some JEDI leadership practices, right before we dive into like, Hey, do this, try this.

[00:11:41] Joy Dixon: I really want you to just stop for a. And bring to your mind someone you care about. Right? And the reason I say bring to your mind someone you care about. because sometimes we have a tendency to wanna do more for other people than we do for ourselves, right? Bring them to your mind, see their face, and think about if they were in a work situation that was toxic and they were facing all kinds of challenges, how you would.

[00:12:14] Joy Dixon: And they've reached out for help on multiple occasions to know available. Right. So the reason I have you do that, and you can think about yourself as well. I know I just said other people, but you can think about yourself too if you've experienced this. And you know, the reason I have you do that is because sometimes when we think about groups of people, we make them face.

[00:12:38] Joy Dixon: To a certain degree that also dehumanizes them. These are actual individuals who deserve and are entitled to their full humanity. So really keep that in mind. See their faces. These are actual people. When you say and don't say things, it has impact. Okay? And these people, the faces that come to my mind when I think about this are my.

[00:13:06] Joy Dixon: When I get tired, when I'm frustrated, you know, not again, you're telling me about that bar, right? These folks are my why to keep going. Mm-hmm. . So with anything, with anything, we start with ourselves. You know, I know I've said it a couple times already, but this is really where that leadership comes to play.

[00:13:31] Joy Dixon: And remember, all of us are leaders regardless of. Right. So first and foremost, you wanna model the leadership fundamentals, have the courage, be a great listener, build relationships, think critically, all those things, just your basic fundamentals. Model those for people to see. Then you wanna consistently keep learning and growing yourself.

[00:13:53] Joy Dixon: That is of the utmost importance. It's not one book, one seminar, one webinar. You're gonna have to keep doing this, right? We, we keep. And then if you see something, say something, like really say something. So for example, if you're in a meeting, some interaction happens, You know, you go after the meeting because you don't say anything in a meeting for whatever reason.

[00:14:18] Joy Dixon: Welcome, we've all have done it. You go over to the person who received the negative impact and you share like empathy and compassion with them. That's for me, is not saying. Saying something is when you go to the person who calls the harm and you talk to them and you address the issue with them, that is saying something right.

[00:14:46] Joy Dixon: Then you wanna connect with other JEDI champions. So I'm calling all of you JEDI champions on this call because you joined, right? So if you didn't know, now you know Welcome. Right? And then this one is huge and so important to. That's why it's in all caps. It's so intentional is believe people. I as a black woman in the US when I've shared things with other people, the first thing I met with is disbelief.

[00:15:16] Joy Dixon: Believe people you need to do your investigation, follow up. All that is fine, but do it from a place of belief. And if you think you're being just across the. And do that little exercise we did in the beginning. Flip it to somebody else on your team or somebody, or a different, like a different gender, different demographic, a different attribute, and see if you respond the exact same way.

[00:15:44] Joy Dixon: Right? Again, we need to kind of just check in with ourselves, okay? And once we have ourselves together, Or work in progress. There is no together. Really just let that go. If you're striving for it, let it go and then just keep trying to do better, right? Then. That's when we move forward with our teams, and here are some actions that you can put into place with your teams, and I'll share what I've done with mine, which is operationalize your JEDI values.

[00:16:15] Joy Dixon: Don't just have 'em on the website. Say, We're about diversity, equity, inclusion, and belonging. That does nothing. That worked maybe five years ago. because people were like, Ooh, they have the language, they speak it. Maybe they're doing it there now. People see that and they go immediately to your about page, who's on their team, what are they doing?

[00:16:39] Joy Dixon: Hmm. Yeah. They're not about it. Right? So in order to actually make those values, And actually weave them into your leadership and into your culture. You have to operationalize them. And you know, anybody wants to talk specifics. We can talk about that. But really that's really the goal is you have to have processes in place that make it a part of.

[00:16:59] Joy Dixon: So one of the things that I've done or I've done in the past is I'd hold weekly JEDI discussions. This is not anything big, this is not anything outside. Of anything that you do? Every week, every Monday, I would send a message about what's top of mind for me, and in there I would add a quote, you know, roughly around like some JEDI topic or something.

[00:17:21] Joy Dixon: And during standup of that day, I would just check in with folks and like two or three people would respond, share their thoughts about the quote, and then we would move on. This is just part of our standup, so again, it's just part of what we. Right, So you can do this and you can, as people grow, they, you can invite other people to do this.

[00:17:40] Joy Dixon: One of the huge benefits about this is again, it personalizes it because your team's hearing your other team members talk about it and they're like, Wow, okay, really? I hadn't thought about that. And I would tell you one of the ones that was super powerful was the quote from Albert Einstein where he says, Striving for social justice is the most important thing in light.

[00:18:03] Joy Dixon: And people were like, they expected the quotes from Dr. Martin Luther King, but when they saw Albert Einstein had that, they were like, Wow. Right. Because this impacts all of us. It really does. The other piece discuss world events openly, you know, so Brianna Taylor discuss that the Asian women who were murdered in Atlanta have that convers.

[00:18:28] Joy Dixon: Not in a separate meeting, but if you have standup that day, make space for your team, right? Make space for them. And then back to the operationalizing your values. Make JEDI a part of your OKRs or whatever framework you use. Measure it. You have to measure it. And then we, we talked about this heal that brought, really heal that route.

[00:18:55] Joy Dixon: So quick recap. Really it's three parts. When you talk about JEDI leadership practices, we're talking about courage, leadership, fundamentals, as we talked about, you know, inspire, building relationships, having the courage, having the character, inspiring people, thinking critically. Always start with self.

[00:19:16] Joy Dixon: That's of the utmost importa. And then from there, you lead your team. And it's not a sequential piece. It's really kind of iterative. You're just gonna be layering on each time. Right. And as we see here in the image, Yes, absolutely. Practice, practice, practice. Right. So I'm gonna let you in on a not so secret.

[00:19:39] Joy Dixon: Secret. You're not gonna get it right. All the. Okay, you're gonna miss the mark. You really just are right. But each one of those times that you miss the mark, there's an opportunity there. It might be an opportunity to make amends, you know? Cause depending on how big of a miss you made, but there's an opportunity there to keep going.

[00:20:04] Joy Dixon: And when you do this, you're modeling that behavior and other people are watching you model that. And that might inspire and encourage them to like, Oh, I can step out. I don't have to get it right all the time, but I'm gonna do my best each and every time. Right. Cool. So bottom line folks, feel good. I'm glad to hear folks were excited because we got this.

[00:20:31] Joy Dixon: We do. We really do. Right. So the TLDR on this whole thing, Just be a good human and do better. That's it. That's it. You can skip all the other slides. Follow up right here. Hey, as.

[00:20:52] Joy Dixon: And so that's why the Do Better piece was inspired by Madison Butler. I wanna give her a credit, so please, if you're not following her on LinkedIn, I highly recommend it. And this slide itself was inspired by Dr. Rha, Benjamin Rha. Benjamin, who I am just a super fan. And she was talking the other day in San Francisco about her latest book, Viral Justice where she was talking about the power of one.

[00:21:14] Joy Dixon: And then, you know, connecting with other ones, right? And that's what I see here. Each one of us in these like beautiful little squares is one. And as we connect together, we connecting with our other ones. And that leads us with that power for like creating a movement because we need each other. And together, honestly, without a doubt in my mind, we will change the world.

[00:21:40] Joy Dixon: And this is not just a belief. And yes, my name is Joy. True, but this is based on what I've seen and what you've seen throughout history there is change. It is possible, right? And once we make that change, folks, we'll have teams that look like this all. So thank you. Really appreciate your time.

[00:22:14] Lauren Peate:  I had to get myself off mute. That was lovely Joy. Yeah. Just so appreciate the action steps, but also just the encouragement too. So I, we've had some great questions coming in, so I'm actually gonna table all of my questions and just dive straight into the questions from all of you because there's been such amazing ones.

[00:22:31] Lauren Peate: And I'll start with a couple that came through beforehand. But just know if you do have others, please keep putting 'em in the chat. Jenny's monitoring those. And we'll, in a moment we'll also jump to the questions in the chat. So to kick it off, one that I wanted to start with is a question that came in beforehand from Nadia, I think is how you say your name.

[00:22:50] Lauren Peate: And the question was, what story do you tell to convince people about the importance of this issue? So of, of JEDI more generally, especially those who have a negative attitude towards this topic. 

[00:23:01] Joy Dixon: Yeah, I will start by saying I don't try to convince anyone. I really don't. Right. You kinda look at the lovely bell curve.

[00:23:13] Joy Dixon: I'm all about the early adopters and the folks who are kind of like middle of the curve, right? Cause people are going to believe what they wanna believe. I actually had a leader in one of my organizations who went to a class around microaggressions and the only thing he came back with was like, yeah, he, he was a white man and he only thing he came back was like, I experienced them.

[00:23:33] Joy Dixon: I don't see what's the big. Not where I'm placing my energy, right? I place my energy back to like, if we're trying to get to that equation with the movement, you go find other people who are about it, and potentially those people who are resistant might come along. This is when, again, you reframe your language and you make it about the overrepresentation.

[00:23:57] Joy Dixon: You really put the focus on where the issue is. Not that like, that's normal. I don't know how people were thinking when they were thinking that's normal and this is abnormal. Mm-hmm. , that's the issue. Put the focus there, but. Love that. Love that. 

[00:24:15] Lauren Peate: And yeah, honestly the chat, one of the things that got a lot of buzz in the chat was that, that reframe that you've given us around, let's talk about the overrepresentation instead of the underrepresentation, because yeah, that's the issues.

[00:24:25] Lauren Peate: So, love that. I'll do one other that came through beforehand and then I'll pass it to you, Jenny, for some of the ones from the chat. This one's from Poly who I think Okay. I saw earlier and might still be here. So I'll, I'll read what you shared and then if you wanna add, feel free to jump. So the question is how do we grow and learn and get better in, in actionable ways without putting more work on the backs of the folks who are not being included or, you know, on the backs of, of people from marginalized groups.

[00:24:51] Joy Dixon: I really love that question. Mainly for the thoughtfulness, right? Take for self responsibility. You know, it's really easy for all of us, especially, we're all super tech savvy, Hop on. You know, Netflix has a world of documentaries, I'm sure, along with YouTube, right? I'm naming all these companies anyway, but like, you know, but there the information is out there.

[00:25:15] Joy Dixon: Like, you know me, I grew up with like libraries and like, you know, and, and books. So I'm kinda like, it's at your fingertips really. And along with that is really check in what. Right. Really be thoughtful and I appreciate the thoughtfulness in the question and check in with folks. Some people wanna share and some people don't.

[00:25:35] Joy Dixon: Some people wanna share today and they may not wanna share tomorrow. So make it a point to check in with people each and every time. Really the onus is on you. Cause honestly, when you take responsibility for your own learning and your own growth, that shows that person that like, wow, they really care and they're prioritizing this.

[00:25:56] Joy Dixon: They're not making it my responsibility. They're taking on that responsibility themselves, and that's what great leaders. 

[00:26:05] Lauren Peate: I think that those are great points and I, I might just do a follow on on that too. Yeah. Cause I know you mentioned a few names. Madison Butler, we have Benjamin, and we'll share those in the follow up notes.

[00:26:14] Lauren Peate: But I guess just on that, I know there's a lot of enthusiasm in the chat around that, or are there other folks that you recommend we follow or you know, any, any sort of Favorites or people that really, you know, we should, we should be learning about their work. 

[00:26:27] Joy Dixon: Yeah, that's a really great question and I will sit down because there's like a slew of people who are coming to mine and I think starting there with the Madison Belt, just because it's a daily thing, you'll get that daily.

[00:26:40] Joy Dixon: But definitely like Irom Ken, you know how to be an anti-racist. That one's really a great work. And just all his work around that piece of it all. That's the first one that comes to mind, but there are several other people. Thank you for that question. I'm gonna come back with some other folks for you to like check out.

[00:26:58] Joy Dixon: Without a doubt. That sounds amazing. Thank you. Yeah, Jenny. How about 

[00:27:02] Lauren Peate: some other chat questions? 

[00:27:04] Jenny Sahng: Yes. Yeah, so here's a question that I think a lot of people relate to. So from Trish. So getting buy-in at the top level to heal root rot is hard. And that can also result in false buy-in.

[00:27:17] Jenny Sahng: So a recent approach I've taken is to then is to get them to acknowledge and accept that the root robot exists first. Do you have any other strategies that could be used? Inre fill for Brita. Jump in if, if there's any other context you'd like 

[00:27:27] Joy Dixon: to add. Yeah, please do. I think that is really great. I think the acknowledgement piece, because you have to start at start, right?

[00:27:35] Joy Dixon: I think also with this process, it's, it would be ideal if leadership would just join in and participate and support these efforts. It just doesn't always happen. That's why. So this is again, where you connect with the folks who you. Might be on your same level or you know, whatever in the organization.

[00:27:58] Joy Dixon: And then work with them because it is true that you can have grassroots movements that really get the attention of leadership, right. And then that way they're like, Okay, well it's not just her, or it's not just him, or it's not just them. This is a whole group. Like our company really cares about these issues.

[00:28:21] Audience 1: Just to follow on, to add additional context as well, Joyce. I think sometimes those that are in power, so to speak, like the advocates sometimes need the education on it. So how do we educate the, those advocates? So I have one example where a senior leader, you know, I gave them some education, shall we say, on unconscious bias.

[00:28:42] Audience 1: that was impacted towards me, but, and it went really well because of how I. And how I framed it up in a very good framework, but the amount of emotional toil that it took on me to present it, I'll get to that point, was quite hard, isn't it? So it's about, it's a combination of what strategies, but also recognizing that some of these individuals, and this one specifically wanted to make change but didn't know how and, but because of their own upbringing and their own, their own environments, they struggled to get it, but they knew.

[00:29:10] Audience 1: They wanted to. So it's how we help support them sometimes as well as the 

[00:29:14] Joy Dixon: follow on question. Yeah. Yeah. And that's really great. And I think like for that for that, I would say there's a couple things. One is sometimes the education card is just used as, you know, a reason not to do. Right. And I, I really just, this is me personally.

[00:29:38] Joy Dixon: There are those people who wanna learn. I got that. But again, I would ask the person, like, what efforts have they put forward in gaining their own knowledge? Cause that tells me a lot. If it's really a priority for you or is this a way for you to stall? Right, because there's too much information out there right now, and it seems like it may not be a priority.

[00:30:01] Joy Dixon: And honestly, sometimes I even have that conversation with people. Let's just tell each other the truth, you know, And hats off to you for you know, doing that. And, you know, if it's taking a toll on you. I, I would definitely self care first and for. Yeah, with 

[00:30:22] Lauren Peate: that individual 

[00:30:23] Audience 1: specifically, he actually got it like it was so awesome.

[00:30:26] Audience 1: Maybe actually, oh, that was worth it because it was something, But I recognize it's not a repeatable thing for other individuals or for other scenarios if the, in that scenario, the individual was actually keen to understand. Whereas there are other ones are like, Nah, I don't need to worry about that.

[00:30:41] Audience 1: That how we support those that want to, but don't know how to. As well as is some of the key parts because that fake buy-in. It's a false buy-in that they go, Yeah, I know what to do, but they don't. And it's that practice in those 

[00:30:54] Joy Dixon: ones. Yeah. Yeah. And you go try. Go ahead. Oh, I was just gonna say, really like the person you're speaking about, it sounds like there was that willingness and I think again, putting it back to them to actually do their work.

[00:31:09] Joy Dixon: Right? Because remember, this is not something separate. This is just great leader. If you were really doing those thing, if you were being a great leader, then a lot of this would already be covered in how you interact with everybody. So I would bring it back to that as opposed to this is a whole new thing you have to learn and study.

[00:31:29] Joy Dixon: That's great. 

[00:31:30] Lauren Peate: I'm gonna squeeze in one more question and I'll just apologize now for not getting to all of your questions. There were so many rich questions in the chat. We'll do one more and then I will say some of these topics coming up will be really rich for people to workshop a bit in the small groups.

[00:31:45] Lauren Peate: Too. That's a great place for the personal spaces because we're not recording that part of it too. So definitely do bring that. And Joy also has generously offered to stick around and be part of our small group discussions, so you might even get to continue the conversation in a small group with her.

[00:31:58] Lauren Peate: But yes, so, so to wrap it up, one of the other questions that we got was from Nicola asking. Global organization where each country has its own unique issues and cultural differences that relate to, to justice, equity, diversity, and inclusion. And so the question was how do we align as a company on which areas to prioritize?

[00:32:19] Joy Dixon: That is an awesome question. That is really awesome because we are global nowadays, right? I'm sitting in Oakland, California, right? So we are very much a global world and you know, organizations I think first and for. Would be the ones that are foundational. I think that is how I would approach it. Like the ones that cross the line.

[00:32:42] Joy Dixon: It's really challenging. So I think about, as we kind of chatted earlier about, you know, we were talking about holidays in different places, right? So it can be something as simple as like the holidays, right? But really again, having those foundational leadership practice. Is really first and foremost. So you can start off with the holidays because I have actually been around people who have said, Wow.

[00:33:08] Joy Dixon: So I see their holidays are honored, but mine aren't. Right? I know it might seem small, but it's huge to people and they may not say it right. Like, how come mine's not showing up on the calendar? Or you're not acknowledging it? Right. So really I think just even starting. Would be something to, because that will bring awareness to folks that would bring awareness.

[00:33:33] Joy Dixon: And I know there was a question about like, people to follow. Here's a really good resource and it kind of dovetails what the education piece because people do need it. I'm not gonna say that they don't. Right. You know, it's just whoever's willing to deliver it Right. Is Glenn Single. He does courageous conversations, Highly recommend, and you know, you can have him come to your organization and put on workshops in a full nine.

[00:33:57] Joy Dixon: He's been doing this for decades. He's not like somebody who just spun up this in the past five or so years. He's really been at this practice of really having these conversations, the rich conversations, the bridging conversations, right? Cause oftentimes that's what it needs, all of us, right? So he's really.

[00:34:17] Joy Dixon: Masterful at, you know, creating those spaces for us to feel safe and to really share. So I highly recommend him as well. Amazing. 

[00:34:28] Lauren Peate: Well, with that, I'm gonna move us to a different type of conversation so we're not ending the conversation, we're just shifting the format. And like I said, this is a space for some of those nitty nitty things that you wanna dive deeper into.

[00:34:39] Lauren Peate: This is the place to bring it up. Just before we turn off the recording quickly, for those who've been joining later in the future, virtually, thanks so much for joining. If you wanna continue the conversations, we do have more meetups and also a Slack group. And so that info's on our website at

[00:34:54] Lauren Peate: So thanks so much for joining. I'll turn off the recording.

Brooke Mills
Brooke Mills
Business Operations
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